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Rebuild and repaint
fastjeff
#62 Posted : Friday, April 02, 2010 10:18:42 PM(UTC)
fastjeff

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Had good luck with Rule. Be sure to get the normal, swinging float. The design where the float goes up and down inside the pump housing tends to jamb, and the all-electronic one that cycles every minute or so will drive you nuts!

Jeff
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

pfhlaw
#63 Posted : Saturday, April 03, 2010 11:10:47 AM(UTC)
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I recommend Rule.
I had Lovetts in my first 2 boats until I found the rubber belts had dried out and broken, rendering the pump useless.
Rules are direct drive meaning the impeller is mounted directly on the motor shaft, eliminating the need for
rubber belts.
Peter
1981 32' sedan bridge
twin Chrysler 360 cu. in. 250 hp engines
Raw water cooled
Nimbus II
Home port: New Buffalo, MI
Dr Gonzo
#64 Posted : Wednesday, August 11, 2010 4:37:42 AM(UTC)
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Here's an update on my 37' dcfb. The new rub rail is on and the window tracks are being installed. I built a containment around the boat so the sand blaster can finally sandblast the bottom and mickey from widener boat works can finally paint the bottom with e-paint ZO.
Greg from Gregs custom engines in riverview, mi is building the first of two engines, now that we finally found all the parts needed to complete the assembly. Two years in the wait...is that finally the light at the end of the tunnel ?

Chrysler 440's have some weird head issues so those of you with popping and backfiring problems may want to do some leak down testing as you may be surprised what you will find. I found out that Chryslers develope some minute cracks on a lot of the heads that may attribute to the problem. There are also some valve issues on some of the chrysler heads that appear over time
Dr Gonzo
#65 Posted : Monday, November 01, 2010 3:39:12 PM(UTC)
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Ok here's the latest on my 37' dcfb. Greg finally got my port engine into the dyno and did 5 pulls starting at 32 degrees advance and ending with 36 degrees advance. The results using the stock intake and carb were as follows. The best of all the pulls was with the timing set at 36 degrees of total advance. Horsepower is 368 with a whopping 490 pounds of torque at 2800 rpm using the stock chrysler camshafts that were re-ground by Lunati to the specs of their cam p/n #60300 . The new pistons are forged S.R.P with a compression ratio of 9.5 : 1. The distributors are M.S.D running the standard 6-A box. It was wonderful news to know that the stock carbs did not need to be re-jetted with the air / fuel mixture coming in at 13.5 : 1 . Besides the M.S.D. ignition the only other exotic piece on the engines are the addition of the comp cams Ultra Pro Magnumâ„¢ Rocker Arm kit. This is a shaft style kit very much like the stock units but allow for each rocker arm to be adjusted individually and the roller tipped rocker arms have needle bearings that ride on the shaft to futher reduce valve train stress and enhance economy.

Id like to thank all the members of this site for all you help and advice and to Greg from Greg's engines in Riverview, Michigan for one hell of a job on the engine build. Now comes the fun part....getting them back into the boat hopefully this week. Pray

fastjeff
#66 Posted : Monday, November 01, 2010 11:30:52 PM(UTC)
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You may get pissed at me for saying this, but 36 degrees advance is way too much for a marine engine. Sure, it makes maximum power at that setting, but you're not using it to run a dyno! The always uphill running of a boat puts tremendous stress on a motor, hence the conservative spark advance.

My drag racing buddy was stunned when I told him the recommended max advance for my old Vortech SB Chevy was only 26 degrees. He said it could take 35 easy. I like pistons without holes in them better than a bit more power, so...

Jeff
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

Dr Gonzo
#67 Posted : Tuesday, November 02, 2010 3:45:27 PM(UTC)
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Jeff...no not at all. I like it when someone plays the devils advocate. If you like , I can post the dyno results and let you look for yourself. Greg didnt say that we had to set the timing at 36 degrees. It will be set somewhere between 32 and 36 degrees of total advance because thats the area the cam grind likes to work within. Exhaust temps even at 36 degrees were mild but again thats on the dyno. With the working load of the transmissions turning the props all that will change. The dyno was done just to check jetting and the metering rod transition curve to make shure that with the new cam grind the engines wouldnt be running to lean. Remember...the goal with this build was more bottom end torque for docking and much better economy while under way. All this comes from the balancing of the crank, proper line honing, proper cylinder bore sealing and the reduction of valve train friction. Mild porting and port matching of the stock intake manifold and heads plus the M.S.D ignition also helps in this regard as well.

Now if you add all this up and add that to the fact that the 37' dcfb is a very light and efficient hull design what I will have is a boat that will be able to be used on a regular basis even at todays high gas dock prices while most other boaters will be sitting at their docks crying in their beer at the high cost of fuel and how much it takes just to push their high rise plastic condos around from point A to Point B.

http://www.gregsheadsandengines.com
fastjeff
#68 Posted : Tuesday, November 02, 2010 9:18:38 PM(UTC)
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Guy does impressive work!

Jeff
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

Dr Gonzo
#69 Posted : Monday, March 07, 2011 4:26:15 PM(UTC)
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Has anyone done a wrap around bench seat on the bridge of a 37' dcfb?
DG
comptime
#70 Posted : Monday, March 14, 2011 10:29:12 AM(UTC)
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I thought about it on my 37 DC but in theory only lol. I would be interested in seeing what you come up with.
Randy
PROST
1982 37 Aft Cabin
Chrysler 440's
Prost
Ford Yacht Club
Grosse Ile Michigan
fastjeff
#71 Posted : Monday, March 14, 2011 2:18:31 PM(UTC)
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Not to act pissy, but a brief dyno pull is not comparable to HOURS of slogging along, pushing a boat "up hill". I would definitely back off a few degrees on that timing.

Jeff

PS: Marine Power sets the timing on their 315 hp, 350 cube Vorteck SB Chevies at 26 degreees total advance. That's a high turbulence cylinder head, yet they only run 26 degrees. Drag racers (brief power spurts) run 36 to 40 with the same heads.
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

Dr Gonzo
#72 Posted : Tuesday, March 15, 2011 3:49:13 AM(UTC)
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Randy. This is George Mathis old boat. It's over at Gibraltar Boat yard now. Bottom was blasted last summer but never painted as of yet. still have to get the canvas work done and the engines aligned. New Iss gauges are coming and I still need to patch the holes from the sumlog sending unit since they dont make them any more.
Jeff...The actual timing will be set with the boat underway. The dyno was mainly to see if the carb jetting was OK. Greg does most of the engine building for a lot of the boaters around our area. Trust me when I tell you ....this man is a true artist with engines and he will set and tune them to perfection when the time comes.

DD
fastjeff
#73 Posted : Tuesday, March 15, 2011 5:54:48 AM(UTC)
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Okay. Just looking out for you, 'cause nobody wants holes in their pistons.

Jeff
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

Dr Gonzo
#74 Posted : Wednesday, July 27, 2011 9:57:58 AM(UTC)
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Here's an update on my yet to be splashed 37 dcfb. I decided to replace the shaft packing and replaced with "dripless packing". The marina finally painted the bottom with the e-paint ZO system and the port engine is assembled and the starbord engine needs about 3 hours time and it will be done. I mounted the MSD Box where the old chrysler box was mounted using four #10 pan head machine screws and some 3/4" spacers I found at the home depot. The plastic cover actually fits over with out any problems. Aside from some minor wiring to get the engine alarm system to work without the stock ignition system, we are in business. I'm about 3 days away from splash and I have a minor concern regarding the alternator rotation. I think that I have them on their respective engines but I would like to double check just to make shure. Does anyone know how to test for this ?

Denis Davison
fastjeff
#75 Posted : Wednesday, July 27, 2011 12:25:47 PM(UTC)
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Either the vanes are straight (not lagging blades, like an impeller) or they are not. If straight the alternators will cool in either direction. If not, it has to rotate only one way. Study the blades and see which you have.

Jeff

PS: A photo would help.
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

Dr Gonzo
#76 Posted : Thursday, August 04, 2011 9:21:42 PM(UTC)
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I ran into a problem after installing the new forward bilge pump. I know its wired correctly and after running down the wires I came across a small tractor battery size battery box located in the compartment that access's the water tank and the hot water heater on the port side. Coming up from under the floor in front of this little battery box is 2 or 3 black 12 gauge wires with small eyelet terminals and an orange wire that leads back to the rear of the engine bay and up to an upside-down mounted panel with four switch style airpax circuit breakers. Two of the breakers are for the 12 volt accessory panels and the other two are marked aft pump and forward pump. Does anyone here that owns a 1982 dcfb have this same thing or is this something that was done by the original owner. all the wire terminations look like something that would hook up to a small tractor battery.
Dr Gonzo
#77 Posted : Monday, August 08, 2011 11:45:50 AM(UTC)
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Ok....I figured out what the mystery wire terminated to. It seems that rather then running lager copper wire from the engine bay for the anchor windlass, what the installer did was to run # 10 wire from the main battery's to a tractor battery mounted amid-ship and then go from the battery up to the windless motor as a way to buffer the amount of current thats pulled by the windlass under load.

Anyone who has a 1982 37' dcfb please contact me. I have questions on 2 sets of wires and what they actually power.
At the lower helm mounted on the ceiling is a hinged switch panel. on the far right side of that panel are 3 wires. One is orange, one is red and one is light blue. On my boat, the orange and red wires are twisted together and taped and the light blue wire is just cut.

On that same panel, on the far left side are 2 black wires with one having a white stripe that are not connected to anything.

If anyone can help with these 2 mystery circuits please feel free to jump in.

Thanks
Denis
jralbert
#78 Posted : Monday, August 08, 2011 2:09:04 PM(UTC)
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Actually, Denis, that other battery was the recommended installation (or a variatiohn thereof) that I read about in DIY magazine. That deep cycle battery took the responsibility for the windlass away from the critical ship's batteries and could be maintained with a small (trickle) charger mounted neat it. Having that battery close to the windlass made it possible to use much smaller wiring on part of the circuitry.

Wish I could locate that article.. I once posted it here but it's buried down too deep in my ever-growing "pile" at the moment
Joel Albert, Potomac MD
"Charlie B" - 1988 32' FBS
Twin 318's/FWC/16x15 nibral props
docked Deale, MD
trontek
#45 Posted : Monday, August 08, 2011 4:02:46 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Roper Go to Quoted Post
Marinettes are true planing hulls. They're not speedboats, but neither are they displacement or semi-displacement hulls. They all cruise at 2.5 to 3 times hull speed, and that's absolutely planing. (Hull speed in knots assumed to be 1.34 x square root of waterline length).

Anything above hull (aka displacement) speed takes lots of power, and hence lots of gas. True displacement hulls are the most efficient at displacement speeds; planing boats going slow only seem efficient compared to the prodigious fuel consumption when they're planing.


How does this apply to the "We Be Jammin'"? 40' catamaran?
Jim

dougrose
#79 Posted : Monday, August 08, 2011 5:57:51 PM(UTC)
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There has been a lot of discussion about catamarans, in particular Sorrydog's giant one.

Planing requires a pretty wide beam, so that the water pressure can build up under the hull and not just squeeze out to the sides. The most efficient beam-to-width ratio is around 1/3, and that is what most of the Marinettes are. Mine for instance is 10' beam and around 30' on the waterline.

Semi-displacement hulls are narrower, often running with a beam 1/4 or 1/5 times the length. Their "displacement mode" lasts to higher speeds and they transition to full planing gradually. It takes a ton of power to plane them off fully.

A catamaran hull is also skinny, and often won't plane very well. They do, however, go pretty fast before they even try to plane, and that is where you get with normal weight and horsepower.

I have no idea whether the cats will actually plane, but I suspect not. But I have only seen one, and that was at dock. Anybody able to supply performance figures for their cat?


1975 32' Flybridge Sedan, twin Perkins 6-354 diesels, 1:1.53 velvetdrives, 16 X 19 props. Merritt Island, Florida
Dr Gonzo
#80 Posted : Tuesday, August 09, 2011 1:25:25 AM(UTC)
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Dougrose: where did you find those formulas. That the very thing I was trying to remember when I posted. My Dad had a book that had all that information in it and It somehow got lost or stolen.

As far as the catamaran goes I do know that they are much more stable as far as ride goes.,
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