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Capac probe any good?
tr_guy79
#1 Posted : Tuesday, April 07, 2009 7:41:47 AM(UTC)
tr_guy79

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How do I tell if it is any good while it is still out of the water? SHould I worry about the barnacles on it?






If it is no good, can I get a replacement? This is the actual meter





Thanks,

-Shane
"McKenna Renee"
1972 '32 FB Express. Twin 318 / Edelbrock 1409s
Chesapeake City Md (Upper Bay / C&D Canal)
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fastjeff
#2 Posted : Tuesday, April 07, 2009 10:02:20 AM(UTC)
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I think there's some resistance test for the probe--not sure. THe meter head is just a dumb volt meter, so if that goes away you can use a digital VOM instead--it also works better.

If the probe is shot, then you'll need to buy a test probe that you toss over the side. One lead goes to a digital VOM, the other to ground. Not hard to make and use.

Jeff

PS : You'll make lots of friends at your marina if they findout you can test THEIR boat as well!

"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

pfhlaw
#3 Posted : Tuesday, April 07, 2009 10:09:34 AM(UTC)
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Shane:
As you probably know, the Capac meter is just a voltage meter that measures the DC voltage created by the “battery effect” of dissimilar metals reacting in an electrolyte bath. As the meter states, our aluminum is protected from corrosion if the voltage is between .90 and 1.05 volts

Your probe is the reference electrode (positive) leading to the meter. The other wire on the back of the meter is grounded to the hull. The reference electrode is made of silver (a stable bio-unfriendly metal like copper) which is then electroplated with a silver chloride coating for even more corrosion protection. Even without it's silver chloride coating (amonium will dilute it), the electrode will still work. But if it's painted over, it will be insulated and won't work. Those few barnacles should not prevent your probe from working.

If you want to test it while on the hard, use a 1.5 volt flashlight battery (D, C or AA it doesn't matter)
Connect the negative end of the battery with a wire to the aluminum hull, and touch the positive end of the battery to the reference electrode while a friend pushes the button on the meter. If it reads close to 1.5 volts, the probe is working. If it doesn't, it might be a bad meter or bad connections at the terminals, the splice in the wire from the probe, or a bad ground wire to the hull.

Send me a PM with your e-mail address and I'll send a copy of the Capac manual.
Peter
1981 32' sedan bridge
twin Chrysler 360 cu. in. 250 hp engines
Raw water cooled
Nimbus II
Home port: New Buffalo, MI
Docsnow
#4 Posted : Tuesday, April 07, 2009 10:40:24 AM(UTC)
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Peter,

Great write up on how to test the senor on the hard. Possibly Joel, could lock it in the How To thread so others would have a easy time finding it the subject just came recently & I gave out so bummer info telling the member I didn’t think it could be used unless it was in the water.d'oh!

Norm,
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Gypsy Girl
#5 Posted : Wednesday, April 08, 2009 12:30:42 AM(UTC)
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For those of us that do not know, "reference electrode"??? (what,where)
I think this is a great test and one for the memory ....



"Figure it out"
pfhlaw
#6 Posted : Wednesday, April 08, 2009 1:56:34 AM(UTC)
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If you look at Shane's first photo, it's the round disk on the bottom of the boat.
On my 1982 32' it's located close to the front of the port engine.
The center 2" disk is the reference electrode. The larger 6" disk is just a plastic insulator.

If your anodes are working properly, they will generate a slight electrical charge as they corrode and sacrifice themselves.
Ions from the zinc or magnesium anode will travel to the positive terminal, which is any metal that is more noble.
Aluminum is more noble than magnesium and zinc, so anodes made of those 2 metals will protect our aluminum hulls as long as the potential (voltage) is within a certain range. Below that range and the aluminum is not fully protected. The aluminum starts to act as a sacrificial anode "protecting" other more noble metals like stainless shafts, brass or bronze, by corroding and shedding aluminum ions. This is what happens if a brass cutlass bearing is installed by the boatyard instead of a phenolic or non-metalic bearing.

Look at the pictures of Jeff's bottom. Um, let me rephrase that. Look at the pictures of Jeff's hull.

If the potential is above the safe range you are creating a "battery" that is too big. You have too much anode surface area or you are using magnesium anodes in salt water. That causes the current to pull too many ions from the anode and push them to the aluminum hull. The hull and anodes are no longer polarized (electrically ballanced) and you have begun to electroplate the aluminum with magnesium or zinc.

Sandblasted, barnacled and painted-over Capac reference electrodes can be salvaged as long as the silver disk or screen is still there.
Once you remove the barnacles or paint and get down to the silver, you can use ordinary salt to deposite the chloride back on the silver.

I'll try to attach a diagram of the electrode.
pfhlaw attached the following image(s):
pfhlaw attached the following image(s): untitled.bmp
Peter
1981 32' sedan bridge
twin Chrysler 360 cu. in. 250 hp engines
Raw water cooled
Nimbus II
Home port: New Buffalo, MI
tr_guy79
#7 Posted : Wednesday, April 08, 2009 3:10:22 AM(UTC)
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What is the process for rechloriding? How do you know if you need to?
"McKenna Renee"
1972 '32 FB Express. Twin 318 / Edelbrock 1409s
Chesapeake City Md (Upper Bay / C&D Canal)
Gypsy Girl
#8 Posted : Wednesday, April 08, 2009 4:39:02 AM(UTC)
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THANKS, I feel so much better when I ama lernin...
Alot more things to see in Marinette Land...





"Figure it out'
mrschmidt
#9 Posted : Thursday, April 09, 2009 9:44:57 AM(UTC)
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How long does the boat have to be in the water to get a accurate capac reading?


Thanks , Smitty
rockit
#10 Posted : Thursday, April 09, 2009 2:03:24 PM(UTC)
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John A told me the boat should be in the water about a month to get an accurate capac reading.

Joe
Joe
1977 28' Express
Twin 318s, raw water cooled
Ohio River
fastjeff
#11 Posted : Thursday, April 09, 2009 10:47:06 PM(UTC)
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Agreed, though readings on mine stablize in a week or so.

Jeff
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

old32
#12 Posted : Friday, April 10, 2009 12:18:23 AM(UTC)
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i bought a guppy from john A when i hooked it up there was no change is there a delay on it too?time for water to soak in the metal??sacrifical corrosion to start?


tim
72 32' express
"http://www.theboaters.com/boats/Powerboat_Express_Cruiser_marinette_1972_anticipation"
pfhlaw
#13 Posted : Friday, April 10, 2009 4:52:02 AM(UTC)
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Shane:
The process for re-chloridating the silver sounds simple, but I have not tried it. According to the white paper I found on line, it's a simple electroplating process using a 5% salt solution or a mild solution of hydrochloric acid. Salt is sodium-chloride (NaCl) and hydrochloric acid is hydrogen-chloride (HCl). If the old silver-chloride must be stripped, ammonia will dissolve it. Then, a 1.5 or 9 volt battery is used to impress a DC current which bonds the chloride ions to the silver electrode. If I find the article I will post it here.
Peter
1981 32' sedan bridge
twin Chrysler 360 cu. in. 250 hp engines
Raw water cooled
Nimbus II
Home port: New Buffalo, MI
fastjeff
#14 Posted : Friday, April 10, 2009 7:10:41 AM(UTC)
fastjeff

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... bought a guppy from john A when i hooked it up there was no change"

Could be you didn't wait long enough. If you're in fresh water, however, and that's a zinc guppy, then it's not going to contribute much anyhow. A magnesium guppy on mine adds about 0.1 volts--and immediately.

Jeff
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

tr_guy79
#15 Posted : Friday, April 10, 2009 10:08:36 AM(UTC)
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Quote:
If the old silver-chloride must be stripped, ammonia will dissolve it.


But the real question is, how do you know if you NEED to redo the AgCl
"McKenna Renee"
1972 '32 FB Express. Twin 318 / Edelbrock 1409s
Chesapeake City Md (Upper Bay / C&D Canal)
old32
#16 Posted : Friday, April 10, 2009 10:21:49 AM(UTC)
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jeff,i'll check when i get back forgot to this morning.it's suppose to be a magnesium guppy .as soon as the admiral gets home from work we are going back.

tim
72 32' express
"http://www.theboaters.com/boats/Powerboat_Express_Cruiser_marinette_1972_anticipation"
fastjeff
#17 Posted : Friday, April 10, 2009 11:21:53 AM(UTC)
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If it's a mag guppy, and it's well grounded--I use a railing post--then its effect should be noticable right away.

Jeff
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

old32
#18 Posted : Sunday, April 12, 2009 7:19:43 AM(UTC)
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d'oh! jeff ,no change .72 with or without.

tim
72 32' express
"http://www.theboaters.com/boats/Powerboat_Express_Cruiser_marinette_1972_anticipation"
fastjeff
#19 Posted : Sunday, April 12, 2009 11:44:42 PM(UTC)
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Are you sure the ground on the railing post is a good one? And are you waiting a few minutes?

Jeff

PS: Is this a zinc or mag guppy?
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

pfhlaw
#20 Posted : Monday, April 13, 2009 4:01:22 AM(UTC)
pfhlaw

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Tim:
Have you tested and calibrated the capac meter?
Peter
1981 32' sedan bridge
twin Chrysler 360 cu. in. 250 hp engines
Raw water cooled
Nimbus II
Home port: New Buffalo, MI
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