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Starboard engine still not drawing water
rockit
#1 Posted : Sunday, September 06, 2009 11:42:45 AM(UTC)
rockit

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You may remember my saga from last fall. I didn't work on the starboard engine much this year because I pulled out the interior. Installed new panels (luan covered with those recycled plastic panels), had new countertops made (white laminate) and new bulkheads covered with the same white laminate. Now that I'm nearly finished with the interior--got most of the galley back together today--I'm focusing again on the starboard engine.

After installing a rebuilt water pump that did not draw water through the strainer and letting the mechanic of the day at the marina try to fix it--and you guessed it, he put it in backwards once so he had put two impellers in on top of a new thermostat--I ended up installing a new water pump. Still no water pulling through the strainer. Today I installed an o-ring on the strainer and a new domed top. Last week, I pulled both hoses off both the port and starboard sea-cocks and the flow out of both was the same. Just to check, I pulled the hose off the transmission cooler and water came out. It seem some water is getting drawn, but you can't see it going through the strainer like you can with the port engine. Today, I got the strainer top on so tight, I had to yank it to get it off--kind of a suction effect. Still not drawing water through the strainer. Last year I pulled the transmission cooler and ran a coat hanger wire through all the holes.

What's left?

Thank you.
Joe
1977 28' Express
Twin 318s, raw water cooled
Ohio River
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Capt T
#2 Posted : Sunday, September 06, 2009 12:19:48 PM(UTC)
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Is water flowing out of the exhaust. one of my strainers bubbles when water is passing through and the other does not look like the water is running through it but when I check the exhaust both are putting out same amount of water. You did not mention the engine temp is it operating normal or running hot? Last thing i would check is all the hoses for blockage, it is possible that an impellor came apart and is blocking the path. Also a little hint, when replacing impellors fill housing with dish soap. this will enable the blades to flip incase it is installed backwards. DO NOT use anything with petrolium in it as this eventually weakens blades.
1978 Aft Cabin
Twin Chrysler 440's
Fox Road Marina

My Father once told me "if you ever need a helping hand, just look to the end of your arm!"
rockit
#3 Posted : Sunday, September 06, 2009 12:45:37 PM(UTC)
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Yes, the engine is overheating--or it least it was prior to the new water pump. I see water flowing out the exhaust, but the exhaust is partially submerged so it's hard to tell if it's just flowing out when the boat rocks or actually flowing.

Good tip on the impeller. Thanks.

Joe
1977 28' Express
Twin 318s, raw water cooled
Ohio River
Capt T
#4 Posted : Sunday, September 06, 2009 1:26:27 PM(UTC)
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you mentioned the replacing water pump, did you check the water circulating pump on the front of the motor? Have someone watch the exhaust and juice the throttles once or twice, you should see the water shoot from exhaust. I'll mention again check all hoses, especially up by the thermostat. I have pulled many impellor blades from there blocking water flow. additionally the soap in the housing will bubble out the exhaust to let you know your pumping water.Think
1978 Aft Cabin
Twin Chrysler 440's
Fox Road Marina

My Father once told me "if you ever need a helping hand, just look to the end of your arm!"
jralbert
#5 Posted : Sunday, September 06, 2009 2:42:41 PM(UTC)
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I had similar problems last year (there is a trail of reports on it thru the engine/mechanical prt of this site). What cured it finally this spring: 1- I put new gaskets in the strainer and I see that you have done that already along with a new top piece. 2- I changed the hoses that run from the seacock to the strainer. The old ones had some cracks that seemed minor to the eye.

But the combination of those things cured the o'heating. good luck as you chase it down. The other posts here have good suggestions; Also, look up the ones given to me last year. I decided that I agree with those who said it was an air leak preventing water from being circulated properly. By the way, you didn't say whether you have a raw or fresh water cooled system.
Joel Albert, Potomac MD
"Charlie B" - 1988 32' FBS
Twin 318's/FWC/16x15 nibral props
docked Deale, MD
rockit
#6 Posted : Sunday, September 06, 2009 3:00:27 PM(UTC)
rockit

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Thanks. Raw water. I've been through the posts--that's why I put the o-ring and the new strainer top.

I'll pull all the hoses and check them for debris and blow some water through the oil cooler. I like the idea about running some soap through too. Good point about the hoses. They look new, but that doesn't mean they are.
Joe
1977 28' Express
Twin 318s, raw water cooled
Ohio River
jralbert
#7 Posted : Monday, September 07, 2009 5:48:45 AM(UTC)
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I've heard of liquid detergent foaming so much it forms a clog. So either use a tiny drop or consider vegetable dye, instead
Joel Albert, Potomac MD
"Charlie B" - 1988 32' FBS
Twin 318's/FWC/16x15 nibral props
docked Deale, MD
fastjeff
#8 Posted : Tuesday, September 08, 2009 4:27:57 AM(UTC)
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I'll bet you have the housing in upside down. One of your 'mechanics of the day' may have reversed the housing.

Note the below sketch on how they go.

Jeff

PS: I did that a few years ago and iut worked just like yours--poorly!

fastjeff attached the following image(s):
fastjeff attached the following image(s): Impeller Orientation.JPG
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NightMoves
#10 Posted : Tuesday, September 08, 2009 9:11:15 AM(UTC)
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Have to agree with Jeff, one of my friends did the same thing with the same results

Mike
DiverDennis
#9 Posted : Tuesday, September 08, 2009 10:42:45 AM(UTC)
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Fastjeff wrote:
I'll bet you have the housing in upside down. I did that a few years ago and iut worked just like yours--poorly!
Been there. Done that. It was humbling Whistle
Surface Interval
1975 28' Express, Single M360
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rockit
#11 Posted : Tuesday, September 08, 2009 1:39:35 PM(UTC)
rockit

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And yes, I put it in upside once last year and one of the mechanics of the day did the same thing this year until I pointed it out. I have the new pump in correctly according to Jeff's diagram. I'll keep digging and post what I find.

Wonder why the pump maker didn't label the inlet and outlet? At least an arrow!

I think we could all make better boats than anybody currently in that business.

Thanks everyone.
Joe
1977 28' Express
Twin 318s, raw water cooled
Ohio River
Capt T
#12 Posted : Wednesday, September 09, 2009 1:40:16 AM(UTC)
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Sorry, should have learned from past mistakes. Told a guy about the soap and since he couldn't keep all the liquid soap from pouring out durring assembly he used powdered soap. What a mess that was, caked up all through out the motor. I use A cheap brand of liquid dish soap, been doing this for years with no problems so far. plus i know right away if I have goofed and put the hoses on the wrong side of pump.(common accurance when we get older)d'oh!. I am leaning towards jralbert say's, I believe you have a split line somewhere and it is sucking air. Check your lines real well.
1978 Aft Cabin
Twin Chrysler 440's
Fox Road Marina

My Father once told me "if you ever need a helping hand, just look to the end of your arm!"
rockit
#13 Posted : Saturday, September 12, 2009 2:57:31 PM(UTC)
rockit

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Thanks everyone. Here's today's report. Pulled the hoses from the strainer to the T fitting and they were all free of debris. Flushed water both ways through the transmission cooler. Put the intake hose from the sea-cock to the strainer on the port engine. It drew fine. Pulled the outlet hose off the T fitting on both engines. Port engine pumps fine. Starboard not at all. Swapped strainers. Same story. I don't see any cracks in the lines, but it has to be that. Maybe I should just buy some hose and replace all of it from the strainer to the pump. Could the oil cooler be the source of an air leak?

The saga continues!

Thank you.
Joe
1977 28' Express
Twin 318s, raw water cooled
Ohio River
fastjeff
#14 Posted : Sunday, September 13, 2009 9:14:39 AM(UTC)
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..."Could the oil cooler be the source of an air leak?
"

No. You'd see oil coming out, or water in the trans.


Jeff
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

old32
#15 Posted : Sunday, September 13, 2009 12:34:18 PM(UTC)
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i had a power steering cooler on my bow rider bust at the sorder joint holding the necked down end on it leaked water and did not leak oil.


tim

72 32' express
"http://www.theboaters.com/boats/Powerboat_Express_Cruiser_marinette_1972_anticipation"
rockit
#16 Posted : Saturday, September 19, 2009 12:13:25 PM(UTC)
rockit

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After eliminating every other possibility, I went to the boat today with some new hose and figured I'd start replacing hoses until I found the problem. The first hose I removed--the one from the oil cooler to the pump was the culprit. There was a break hidden by the hose clamp on the inlet side of the pump. It was one of those old-style hoses with the wire embedded in it. A length of new hose and new hose clamps did the trick. The starboard engine now draws very nicely.

Thanks to everyone for the help.

Joe
1977 28' Express
Twin 318s, raw water cooled
Ohio River
jralbert
#18 Posted : Saturday, September 19, 2009 1:25:51 PM(UTC)
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It must feel good...you were lucky that it was the stbd engine, much easier to get to that part.
Joel Albert, Potomac MD
"Charlie B" - 1988 32' FBS
Twin 318's/FWC/16x15 nibral props
docked Deale, MD
Rick100
#17 Posted : Sunday, September 20, 2009 1:42:35 AM(UTC)
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It was one of those old-style hoses with the wire embedded in it. A length of new hose and new hose clamps did the trick. The starboard engine now draws very nicely.

Thanks to everyone for the help.

[/quote]

Wire insert hose may not be old fashion. That type of hose is made to bend without kinking and the wire also helps to keep the hose from collapsing under suction when it gets hot. If you used heater hose or radiator hose without the wire you may want to check it to see if it holds its shape when the engine is running.
When I die I hope my wife sells my stuff for more than I told her I paid for it.
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