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Vibration
jc000
#1 Posted : Friday, September 24, 2010 6:47:12 AM(UTC)
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I have owned a 28 express for two years. It has always had a vibration at some speeds but not all. The first year I had the prop pitched to 14x10 and balanced. This seemed to help but did not fix the problem. We used the boat about 200 hours with one 500 mile trip to Nashville, Tenn.

We were planning a trip this summer of 1000 miles to Chattanooga Tenn. so I got help and removed the shaft and replaced the cutlass bearing on the strut. When we slid the shaft through the cutlass it would not go through the hole in the bottom of the boat without forcing it. We removed the strut and inspected but could see any bend or ware. We ended up making wedges about 3/16” to match the front bolt holes, and the bottom of the boat. The bottom does not look bent. Reinstalled the strut and inserted shaft and it fit perfect. Put the boat in the water and vibration is still there but at different speeds. We took the boat from Golconda Il. on The Ohio River to Chattanooga Tenn. with no problems. We tried to run where it did not vibrate about 2200 rpm or 12mph.

I am getting ready to take the boat out for the winter but I want to fix the vibration. I had a local mechanic look at it today and he thinks it is behind the coupler back of the transmission. The coupler has a 1” rubber piece between the plates, is this normal? The manual did not show one of these.

Could the strut have been changed with the wrong one putting everything in a bind? How can the strut be identified, I saw no numbers on it?

When we removed the shaft we had to remove the ruder which did not seem correct to me.

Next year we plan to take a trip to Pittsburg Pa. so we need a smooth boat.

Thanks for any thoughts

John
28 express, Single 318 (ACL 813020579)
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collins69s
#2 Posted : Friday, September 24, 2010 6:58:25 AM(UTC)
collins69s

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Right off the top of my head, how about engine mounts? Everything tight? Sounds like a prop issue, but if you had it balanced..Hmm. Curious to see where this goes..
Sean
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1972 32' FB Express
Twin 318s
Docsnow
#3 Posted : Friday, September 24, 2010 7:00:06 AM(UTC)
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John,

I’m sure when U went thru the shaft removal etc & reinstalled it U aligned the couplings as U know there is only a .003 deviation between the shaft & the tranny coupling Brick wall

Norm,

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dougrose
#4 Posted : Friday, September 24, 2010 8:41:42 AM(UTC)
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I have seen several boats with unexplained vibration that were fixed by aligning the engine to the shaft, as Docsnow says. You have to get the engine centered on the shaft, and have to mike around the flanges to make sure that the engine is not just in the right position, but aligned correctly.

Just as a point of information, I have to undo the linkage on the rudder to get a prop off, but do not have to pull the rudder. It should be the same for a shaft.


1975 32' Flybridge Sedan, twin Perkins 6-354 diesels, 1:1.53 velvetdrives, 16 X 19 props. Merritt Island, Florida
fastjeff
#5 Posted : Friday, September 24, 2010 9:03:56 AM(UTC)
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When you shimmed that strut, you should have realigned the coupling. It's gotta be WAY off.

Jeff

PS: All inboard boats have SOME vibration due to the shock wave generated by the prop hitting the bottom of the hull as the blade passes by.
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collins69s
#6 Posted : Friday, September 24, 2010 10:17:08 AM(UTC)
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Seems odd it would vibrate before and after truing up the props.. If the coupling was that far out of alignment wouldn't the strut bearing be worn out in some unusual way?
Sean
SIFF SURF
1972 32' FB Express
Twin 318s
jc000
#7 Posted : Sunday, September 26, 2010 1:35:24 AM(UTC)
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The bearing was worn out in the back bottom, when I installed the new bearing was when the shaft would not go through the hull.

I appreicate the advice and I plan to try engine allignment this week

John
Bill
#8 Posted : Sunday, September 26, 2010 3:07:03 AM(UTC)
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JC
What year Marinette due you have?
The 1" rubber spacer is a GLOBE Drive Saver. These are a very expensive replacement for the original fiber spacer between the couplings. They are part of the isolation system, by the way the original spacers are no longer available.
The way to check your trans coupling to your shaft coupling is to remove the rubber drive saver and pull the two couplings together. The boss on one coupling fits into the other. From your post it sounds like your strut is out of alignment. On mine the strut was bent, I repaired it and when it was re installed the shaft would not go threw the stuffing box tube. I made up a spacer tube with outside diameter of the stuffing box tube and the inside diameter of the shaft.[note] I cut it in half after makeing for easy removal when alignment was finished. Remove the stuffing box after you remove the shaft from the boat. Install the spacer tube. The strut needs to be removed as well. Now put the shaft threw the spacer tube and temp install the coupling to the shaft. Pull the shaft coupling up to the trans-engine coupling. If the boss of one coupling fits into the other than this is good. {note} The stuffing box tube is fixed, cant be moved, but the trans-engine and the strut are adjustable.
If the boat was running good before the strut was bent chances are the trans-engine to the shaft alignment are close.
If so you can now install the strut on to the shaft, you should notice that the strut should pass by the out side of the rudder. You can now determine what shim you will need if any to attach strut to bottom of boat. after you have done this check to make sure the shaft turns by hand while the coupling is bolted up to the trans.[use two bolts to temp hold couplings together] If everything turns freely, remove temporary gage that was installed in stuffing box tube and remove coupling and reinstall packing box, its a good time for new packing. Re install coupling to shaft and re install prop. After launch in spring you will need to fine tune the trans-engine coupling to the shaft coupling. The boat should be in the water in order to check alignment. Than you can re install the globe drive saver.
Bill


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Barkleydave
#9 Posted : Sunday, September 26, 2010 5:02:29 AM(UTC)
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The comment regarding "your shafts will turn freely". That is true if strut is in line with shaft log.

With good cutlass bearings and shafts connected there will be little or NO play in the bearing and the it will take some effort to turn the shafts with the props on. Good bearings will make it hard to turn when dry and often will screek when shaft is turned.

dave
None
jc000
#10 Posted : Monday, September 27, 2010 6:54:46 AM(UTC)
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My 28 Express is a 1979 with the 1" shaft. It has always had more vibration than I think it should. When I had the strut off it was inspected by a boat machanic and a man who runs a machine shop (also made the shims) and they did not think it was bent. The strut looks like an airplane wing and I think a bend could be seen. I talked to John at Marinette and he said there was only one strut made for a 28 single 1" shaft.

Tomorrow I plan to try again at alignment of the engine. I have talked a friend into helping with this prlject and he promiced he could hold me upside down over the bilge until I can complete the work.

I appreicate all the help and advice, I will let you know what happens.

John
fastjeff
#11 Posted : Monday, September 27, 2010 11:13:28 AM(UTC)
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.." he promised he could hold me upside down over the bilge until I can complete the work."

Then don't eat a hearty breakfast that morning!

The easy (hah!) way to do this job is to take out all but one coupling bolt. Back off on it until you can pry the coupling halves apart about .020 ", then mark the coupling (A B C D) with marker. Feeler gage the clearance at 'A' and 'C', then rotate 90 degrees and repeat for 'B' and 'D'. Record every reading--do not try to remember them!--and a pattern will emerge.

I shoot for a max of 0.003" " misalignment.

Jeff
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Barkleydave
#12 Posted : Monday, September 27, 2010 11:51:30 AM(UTC)
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Jeff is correct as always.

This may seem obvious but it is a 3D environment.

I usually work on left/right alignment first then up and down but it truely is an upside down world. lowering the front end will open the top of the coupling.

Make VERY SMALL ADJUSTMENTS! It will not be far out and mark your engine mount bolt head positions before you move anything!
That way you can get it back to the starting point. Us a pry bar use small "bumps" the check the gap all around!

Dave
None
fastjeff
#13 Posted : Monday, September 27, 2010 11:33:46 PM(UTC)
fastjeff

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Oh, something I forgot to mention...... You'll find that the front mounts don't want to slide sideways. Assuming they need to, for adjustments, you'll have to jack up the motor, remove them and clean them up, then coat them with anti-seize. Also, if you want to make a sideways adjustment, you'll either need a Porta Power hydraulic ram, or jack the motor up under the damper and crowbar it to one side.

Fun, fun!

Jeff
"...reality is not nearly as lovely as the world of Liberal Land. No wonder so many people want to go there." - Tom Sowell

jc000
#14 Posted : Tuesday, September 28, 2010 1:05:46 PM(UTC)
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Went to the boat today and had excellent luck. We removed the plastic piece between the plates on the transmission and the shaft, slid the plates together, used a feeler guage and learned the top was .006 and the bottom was 0. We lowered the back engine mounts 1/4 turn on starboard and 1/2 turn on port, slid them together and had less than .002". Reinstalled everything and went for a test drive. It was not really as easy as it sounds standing on our heads for several hours rounding nuts busting nuckles ect. But the boat did better than it has ever done, had vary little vibration until we hit 4000 rpm. I plan to get a new prop over the winter but feel it is good to go.

Thanks everyone for you help and advice. I printed the comments and read them and we went along.

Thanks Again

John
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